Bridget St John’s story is every bit as fascinating as her peers. Recording a demo with John Martyn’s help on a tape recorder owned by Al Stewart, she performed alongside Nick Drake and was signed to John Peel’s Dandelion label, releasing three seminal long-players for the DJ (Ask Me No Questions, Songs for the Gentle Man, and Thank You For …). Though undoubtedly a leading figure in the folk/ singer-songwriter/ folk-rock scene (up there with Martyn, Michael Chapman and Kevin Ayers), mainstream success alluded her. Bridget moved to the US in the 1970s, essentially disappearing, and it wasn’t until the late 1990s that she began making occasional forays back to the UK.
Those Transatlantic trips have continued over the last two decades, with brief (mostly low-key) tours every few years and occasional (mostly re)releases, resulting in a slow reappraisal and rediscovery of her work, and particularly the Dandelion releases.
As previously mentioned on Folk Radio UK she is back in the UK & Ireland for another fleeting visit, she kicks off her 2018 intimate UK tour with a relatively high profile appearance at Birmingham’s Moseley Folk Festival (Sunday 2 September 2018).
Folk Radio caught up with her in NYC before she set off …
You’d released four albums (including Jumble Queen on Chrysalis) and then moved to the US. What led you to relocate to New York in 1976?
For a few years before I went I had some curiosity about visiting New York, but never followed through. When I first went there – in the summer of 1976 – I had booked a flight to return within six weeks. I had been seeing someone who had left the UK months before to travel, who ended up there and suggested I come. I really knew nobody there. I had the contact numbers for Chrysalis publishing, for a couple of music business people who were fans, and for my friend Stefan Grossman’s parents. The little impressions I had of New York were through music and movies, so I basically arrived with few preconceptions and an open mind. They say that no-one has a neutral reaction to New York – you either like it or you don’t – and I very quickly grew to like it a lot. By the time I returned to the UK at the end of the six weeks I knew I wanted to be back there and made all the arrangements to make that happen. I did not have a timeline in mind going forward – I just knew where I wanted to be, so I returned in late November of ’76. By then Stefan’s parents kindly offered me a place to stay – without them at the beginning of this journey my return would not have been possible.
Did you continue to perform in the US? Or did you lay down your guitar?
In June of 1977, I got my first gig at the recently relocated Kenny’s Castaways on Bleecker Street, opening for John Martyn, who was touring America and Canada that summer.
This first gig led to several years of playing New York clubs, either solo or with a band: Kenny’s, The Bitter End, The Bottom Line; some colleges and clubs in the Tri-state area; appearances at The Wollman Rink Concert, in Central Park, opening for Dion and Robert Klein, and at Carnegie Hall opening for The Paul Winter Consort. I went to Nashville briefly to record three tracks with Dave Perkins and members of his band. By September of 1978, I had my own apartment and knew I needed to do whatever it took to pay my bills.
Over the 40 years I have been here I never [put down] my guitar but have done many things to make it possible to still keep playing. I started off waitressing at Kenny’s (having never done that before) then bartended, then cooked in the small kitchen there. Eventually, I became involved in the management side of things – at Kenny’s, at The Bitter End, and The Cat Club.
Is it true you also did some voice overs … ?
I did take Voice Over classes for a brief period – and actually booked one job, but I was not cut out for the endless self-promotion needed to sustain the possibilities of work. Once my daughter was born, in 1983, I played very little live music until 1995; and in 1990 stopped doing other work in nightclubs and found other ways to supplement a living … for a few months I cleaned apartments; I worked as an assistant to a wonderful artist Eng Tay, and then found my way into helping my ‘elders and wisers’ as I call them. Never anything medical, but anything else they might need. I seem to be good at organising – other people at least! To this day I work with a 95-year-old a couple of times a week.
The reputation of your Dandelion material, in particular, continues to grow – how do you view those three albums today?
I suppose the first thing to say is I don’t spend time evaluating the work I have done! I rarely listen to them, or even parts of them. But I will try to answer your question. As I have grown I realise that for me it is about the work and not the result; I cannot control how people will like or not like something I do. I am grateful for the fact that what I recorded all those years ago is still relevant and meaningful to others. I think of the recordings as representing, quite honestly, who I was in those years, and I accept them as they are.
John Peel is credited as producing your debut – how was he as a producer?
John was my first producer – and I believe the perfect person to start me off on this journey. He liked what I did and was supportive of the person I was and of my growth. I had twelve songs I wanted to record; he never questioned my choice but guided me through the sessions. The whole album was recorded in 10 hours – two five-hour sessions. It was a lot of fun – especially when John really got into the production of Ask Me No Questions. He explored the BBC sound effects library and put together the mix of birds and church bells. If I do hear the track it’s something that I still love to listen to – and I am back in the small studio on Old Bond Street.
You played alongside some pretty varied acts, including Bowie, Deep Purple, King Crimson and Jethro Tull. How did you go down with some of their audiences?
For the most part, I remember feeling these audiences accepted me and listened to me; I got positive feedback. The only gig that sticks in my memory as being negative was one that even before I got to the venue I was sure would not work. The Groundhogs had a single that was number three in the charts and were booked to play Newcastle Town Hall. The promoter liked my music and booked me to open. From the minute I walked onto the stage the chant of ‘Groundhogs! Groundhogs!’ roared incessantly through the room – and after five or six songs I left the stage; I couldn’t hear me, and they couldn’t hear me! But you could say that I warmed them up well!
You started returning to play in the UK in the mid-90s after a 20-year gap – what led to that return after so long? And how were those ’90s shows?
In 1995 See For Miles reissued my Dandelion albums on CD, and at that time, for several reasons, I was feeling that I would like to start playing live. I also had many unreleased recordings that I wanted to put out. Through the introduction of Nigel Cross, who I have known for decades and who has been a supporter of my work for a long time, I met John Tobler founder/ owner of Road Goes On For Ever records. I played him the tracks – which would become my fifth album – Take the 5ifth – released on John Tobler’s label. He was instrumental in getting me my first London gig at The Weavers, which I did with an American guitarist/ friend of mine Mick Gaffney. It went really well and opened me up to wanting to continue doing more.
You recently recorded Fly for Mojo’s Nick Drake covers compilation (Green Leaves) – what is it about that particular song you like?
When I was first asked to be involved with the project I was told to think about any songs I would like to do. The first two that came to mind were One Of These Things First and Northern Sky – both from Bryter Layter – my favourite of Nick’s albums. I sang these two songs at a Chickfactor event at Fez (below the now gone Time Café in New York), celebrating what would have been Nick’s 50th birthday (1998). I settled on Northern Sky and called Dave Henderson from MOJO to let him know. He said someone else had already chosen it. (I love Judy Dyble and Andy Lewis’ version). For some reason, Fly came to mind and I decided I really wanted to do that – and even though I had never thought about how I would approach it before, I wanted to challenge myself to interpret it. The turnaround to work on it and record it was quite short, and I basically lived with that song inside me for days. I think it means so much to me because it is from the period that I knew Nick as much as I would ever know him; I think it is saturated with his fragility, sensitivity, and self-awareness; and I found in working on it and singing it that I got back to that time when I knew what it was to feel that way.
Alongside performing your own shows, you have a ‘Kevin Ayers project’ with his daughter, Galen. How did it come about?
Some months after Kevin died in 2013 – already over five years ago! – I received an email from Galen saying she would be coming to New York and would like to meet up. I knew nothing about her – but thought about what I could give her. Looking through my (unorganized) archives I found a couple of handwritten versions of Kevin’s The Oyster and the Flying Fish. When Kevin and I performed that song live, he would write out the words and chords longhand – [this was a] long time before computers. I decided to give Galen one of these when we met. It was a very easy first meeting, and when Galen organised the celebration of Kevin’s life in August of 2013, she invited me to sing May I/ Puis-Je? at the ceremony when Kevin’s ashes were laid in their resting place; and also to sing a couple of songs at the celebration that followed later in the evening. It was a wonderful couple of days. Galen did not return to New York for quite some time but fast forward to the end of 2016, when I performed Suzanne at the City Winery’s tribute to Leonard Cohen. Galen got in touch to say she would be there. I think it was that night that we came up with the idea of working together on some of Kevin’s songs. So slowly over the last year-and-a-half, we got together when we could and started working out our own arrangements. The Oyster and the Flying Fish was the first one, and, at [this time], we perform eight of Kevin’s songs. The project is a lot of fun – and quite fluid and ever-evolving. The last gig we did we added some readings from Kevin’s cookbook recipes and unpublished song/ poems.
What is it you admire about Kevin and his songs?
I always loved Kevin’s voice – with its seemingly effortless, sonorous, warmth… I like our two voices together… He too [like John Martyn] was an early ‘musical brother’ – who disappeared! I relate to his gentler sensitive self. Something In Between, for example, is so honest and poignant; both Jolie Madame and May I?/Puis-Je? are beautiful songs both melodically and lyrically, and I like the humour in many of his songs.
I understand that you’ve been recording recently with Michael Chapman, BJ Cole and cellist Sarah Smout – can you tell us a bit about the recordings? Are they for a new solo album perhaps …?
In early April this year, I went to Wales for the better part of a week to record vocals for Michael Chapman’s next album. I understand it will be released in October. While I had heard of BJ Cole I had never met him. Nor had I met Sarah Smout – though Michael had sung both of their praises for a long time. So these are Michael’s songs – many new – all really good – and the tracks sound great. As you know, I will work with Sarah on the first part of my upcoming tour: cello has always been one of my favourite instruments.
Any other plans for the coming months/ year?
Plans? My life has not been planned out much! But when I turned 70 I decided that I would say ‘yes’ to the things that I wanted to do – and so I have been much more involved with musical projects than for a long time. I have a band that I love in New York: (Annie Nero, bass; Ray Rizzo drums/ percussion; David Nagler keyboards/ guitar). So far we have done a couple of gigs – but I would like to do more band and solo gigs… I would also like to record sometime soon – but have to work out the details… There is the hope to do a vinyl release of the live show I did at The Betsey Trotwood in London in February 2017. I am working out the details of another Japanese series of gigs for December of this year…
I will continue to work on the Kevin Ayers project – and we will think about recording… I would love to work more in the UK and Ireland and even Europe… I am open to possibilities!
* Bridget St John appears at Moseley Folk Festival, Birmingham, on Sunday 2 September 2018. Other acts appearing include The Levellers, Show Of Hands and Richard Dawson (Friday 31 August); Nick Mulvey, This Is The Kit, Willy Mason, Jim White and Imarhan (Saturday 1 September); and Teenage Fanclub, King Creosote, Steve Harley and Martin Carthy (Sunday). For tickets and more information, see: www.moseleyfolk.co.uk
* Bridget St John’s UK tour runs throughout September 2018. For dates and venues see: bridgetstjohn.co.uk